14 New Messages
Digest #9751
Messages
Wed Sep 11, 2013 2:46 pm (PDT) . Posted by:
"David Brostoff" dcbrostoff
On Sep 11, 2013, at 14:35 , Tony <tdale@xtra.co.nz> wrote:
> The red button is the app. Thats the red X Looking at Excel and Word now which have a number of docs open, there is the red X on the top right corner, and below that, a smaller uncoloured x which is to close the app.
>
> Does that help? The red X will close everything as thats Word, not the last open document. The current active document is the small x
What OS does this occur in? In my setup at least, with Word 2011 (OS X 10.8.4) there is no red X. (A red X sounds like Windows.)
David
> The red button is the app. Thats the red X Looking at Excel and Word now which have a number of docs open, there is the red X on the top right corner, and below that, a smaller uncoloured x which is to close the app.
>
> Does that help? The red X will close everything as thats Word, not the last open document. The current active document is the small x
What OS does this occur in? In my setup at least, with Word 2011 (OS X 10.8.4) there is no red X. (A red X sounds like Windows.)
David
Wed Sep 11, 2013 2:54 pm (PDT) . Posted by:
"Tony" tdale@xtra.co.nz
My comments are re Windows. This thread was partly about the issue that closing the last open document also closes the app and all the other docs.
________________________________
From: David Brostoff <davbro@earthlink.net>
To: macsupportcentral@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 12 September 2013 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [macsupport] Mac vs PC
On Sep 11, 2013, at 14:35 , Tony <tdale@xtra.co.nz> wrote:
> The red button is the app. Thats the red X Looking at Excel and Word now which have a number of docs open, there is the red X on the top right corner, and below that, a smaller uncoloured x which is to close the app.
>
> Does that help? The red X will close everything as thats Word, not the last open document. The current active document is the small x
What OS does this occur in? In my setup at least, with Word 2011 (OS X 10.8..4) there is no red X. (A red X sounds like Windows.)
David
____________
From: David Brostoff <davbro@earthlink.
To: macsupportcentral@
Sent: Thursday, 12 September 2013 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [macsupport] Mac vs PC
On Sep 11, 2013, at 14:35 , Tony <tdale@xtra.co.
> The red button is the app. Thats the red X Looking at Excel and Word now which have a number of docs open, there is the red X on the top right corner, and below that, a smaller uncoloured x which is to close the app.
>
> Does that help? The red X will close everything as thats Word, not the last open document. The current active document is the small x
What OS does this occur in? In my setup at least, with Word 2011 (OS X 10.8..4) there is no red X. (A red X sounds like Windows.)
David
Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:00 pm (PDT) . Posted by:
"David Brostoff" dcbrostoff
On Sep 11, 2013, at 14:54 , Tony <tdale@xtra.co.nz> wrote:
> My comments are re Windows. This thread was partly about the issue that closing the last open document also closes the app and all the other docs.
I can't speak for the other participants in the thread but I think they probably assumed, as I did, that since this is a Mac list, you were talking about the Mac OS.
David
> My comments are re Windows. This thread was partly about the issue that closing the last open document also closes the app and all the other docs.
I can't speak for the other participants in the thread but I think they probably assumed, as I did, that since this is a Mac list, you were talking about the Mac OS.
David
Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:31 pm (PDT) . Posted by:
"David Brostoff" dcbrostoff
On Sep 11, 2013, at 14:54 , Tony <tdale@xtra.co.nz> wrote:
> My comments are re Windows. This thread was partly about the issue that closing the last open document also closes the app and all the other docs.
Please ignore my previous reply about assuming that you were commenting about the Mac OS instead of Windows. I hadn't read the thread carefully enough to see that someone had asked about this behavior in Windows.
David
> My comments are re Windows. This thread was partly about the issue that closing the last open document also closes the app and all the other docs.
Please ignore my previous reply about assuming that you were commenting about the Mac OS instead of Windows. I hadn't read the thread carefully enough to see that someone had asked about this behavior in Windows.
David
Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:06 pm (PDT) . Posted by:
"Daly Jessup" dalyjessup
On Sep 11, 2013, at 4:04 AM, Otto Nikolaus wrote:
>
>
> I don't think anyone is saying that closing *any* window also closes the app, just that using the red button to close the *last/only* window does also close the app. I'm still not clear if ctrl-w works in exactly the same way as the red button, though.
As far as I can see, using Control-W closes the window active at the time you press the keys. Control-Q quits the application. Those are the shortcuts shown under the File menu, and those are how it works. You can Control-W all the windows, but the application stays visible in the Dock and doesn't quit until you actually Control-Q it, or quit it from the Dock.
Daly
Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:09 pm (PDT) . Posted by:
"Daly Jessup" dalyjessup
On Sep 11, 2013, at 3:04 AM, Tony wrote:
I wrote:
>> If you close the last Window open from a given application in Windows, then the Application itself quits.
> I think the issue that closing a doc in Windows closes everything, the other open docs and the application, is clearly incorrect.
But Tony, nobody said it did. I said closing the LAST WINDOW from a given application in Windows would case the application to quit.
Not closing just any window!!
Daly
Wed Sep 11, 2013 6:17 pm (PDT) . Posted by:
"Jim Saklad" jimdoc01
> As far as I can see, using Control-W closes the window active at the time you press the keys. Control-Q quits the application. Those are the shortcuts shown under the File menu, and those are how it works.
>
> You can Control-W all the windows, but the application stays visible in the Dock and doesn't quit until you actually Control-Q it, or quit it from the Dock.
> Daly
Except, of course, for the applications in which closing the last window *does* shut down the application....
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jim Saklad mailto:jimdoc@icloud.com
>
> You can Control-W all the windows, but the application stays visible in the Dock and doesn't quit until you actually Control-Q it, or quit it from the Dock.
> Daly
Except, of course, for the applications in which closing the last window *does* shut down the application.
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jim Saklad mailto:jimdoc@icloud.
Thu Sep 12, 2013 4:02 am (PDT) . Posted by:
"Tony" tdale@xtra.co.nz
Hi David
Yes, same here.I'm lost in this thread, it was Windows vs PC re closing docs or app.
Tony
NZ
________________________________
From: David Brostoff <davbro@earthlink.net>
To: macsupportcentral@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 12 September 2013 10:31 AM
Subject: Re: [macsupport] Mac vs PC
On Sep 11, 2013, at 14:54 , Tony <tdale@xtra.co.nz> wrote:
> My comments are re Windows. This thread was partly about the issue that closing the last open document also closes the app and all the other docs.
Please ignore my previous reply about assuming that you were commenting about the Mac OS instead of Windows. I hadn't read the thread carefully enough to see that someone had asked about this behavior in Windows.
David
Yes, same here.I'm lost in this thread, it was Windows vs PC re closing docs or app.
Tony
NZ
____________
From: David Brostoff <davbro@earthlink.
To: macsupportcentral@
Sent: Thursday, 12 September 2013 10:31 AM
Subject: Re: [macsupport] Mac vs PC
On Sep 11, 2013, at 14:54 , Tony <tdale@xtra.co.
> My comments are re Windows. This thread was partly about the issue that closing the last open document also closes the app and all the other docs.
Please ignore my previous reply about assuming that you were commenting about the Mac OS instead of Windows. I hadn't read the thread carefully enough to see that someone had asked about this behavior in Windows.
David
Thu Sep 12, 2013 4:41 am (PDT) . Posted by:
"Otto Nikolaus" nikyzf
On 12 September 2013 01:06, Daly Jessup <jessup@san.rr.com> wrote:
>
> As far as I can see, using Control-W closes the window active at the time
> you press the keys. Control-Q quits the application. Those are the
> shortcuts shown under the File menu, and those are how it works. You can
> Control-W all the windows, but the application stays visible in the Dock
> and doesn't quit until you actually Control-Q it, or quit it from the Dock.
>
Thanks. This clears things up, and shows that even (?) in Windows, it's
easy to avoid closing apps unless you really want to, especially if you use
keyboard shortcuts. Which Windows version is that, BTW?
Otto
>
> As far as I can see, using Control-W closes the window active at the time
> you press the keys. Control-Q quits the application. Those are the
> shortcuts shown under the File menu, and those are how it works. You can
> Control-W all the windows, but the application stays visible in the Dock
> and doesn't quit until you actually Control-Q it, or quit it from the Dock.
>
Thanks. This clears things up, and shows that even (?) in Windows, it's
easy to avoid closing apps unless you really want to, especially if you use
keyboard shortcuts. Which Windows version is that, BTW?
Otto
Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:33 pm (PDT) . Posted by:
"Chris Jones" bobstermcbob
Hi,
On 11 Sep 2013, at 09:36 PM, Jim Saklad <jimdoc@icloud.com> wrote:
>>> I disagree with you that they don't slow down, but it is because most of us load it up with stuff and never remove it. All those little sub-programs to watch and monitor things eventually slow it down. And that goes for iPads and Macs. So it is a problem that can be resolved, if the user thinks about it.
>>
>> Maybe I am being a tad pedantic, but technically the machine itself cannot slow down. That's simply impossible. The system inside will be running at the same clock rate as it was the day you got it. What you describe is something else, which is when you ask a machine to do too many things at once.
>
> 1. Yes, you are being a tad pedantic. The common meaning of a phrase like "the system slows down" is pretty clear to most users.
Fair enough. For me its still an incorrect way of describing the situation, but lets leave it there.
> 2. Modern processors -- at least the ones currently used in iMacs and MacBooks -- DO have the capability of adjusting their clocks upwards and downwards.
Yeah, i half suspected someone might bring is up... True, but doesn't alter my basic argument which is your machine will be running at whatever clock rate, or rates (based on load) it can today as the day your first got it (assuming you haven't started to over or under clock it, or in any other way alter its bios/whatever settings of course... ).
Chris
>
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On 11 Sep 2013, at 09:36 PM, Jim Saklad <jimdoc@icloud.
>>> I disagree with you that they don't slow down, but it is because most of us load it up with stuff and never remove it. All those little sub-programs to watch and monitor things eventually slow it down. And that goes for iPads and Macs. So it is a problem that can be resolved, if the user thinks about it.
>>
>> Maybe I am being a tad pedantic, but technically the machine itself cannot slow down. That's simply impossible. The system inside will be running at the same clock rate as it was the day you got it. What you describe is something else, which is when you ask a machine to do too many things at once.
>
> 1. Yes, you are being a tad pedantic. The common meaning of a phrase like "the system slows down" is pretty clear to most users.
Fair enough. For me its still an incorrect way of describing the situation, but lets leave it there.
> 2. Modern processors -- at least the ones currently used in iMacs and MacBooks -- DO have the capability of adjusting their clocks upwards and downwards.
Yeah, i half suspected someone might bring is up... True, but doesn't alter my basic argument which is your machine will be running at whatever clock rate, or rates (based on load) it can today as the day your first got it (assuming you haven't started to over or under clock it, or in any other way alter its bios/whatever settings of course... ).
Chris
>
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> Group FAQ:
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> Yahoo! Groups Links
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Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:22 pm (PDT) . Posted by:
"Randy B. Singer" randybrucesinger
On Sep 11, 2013, at 4:25 AM, Peter Thompson wrote:
> Perhaps you good people can advise me on what you think needs to be done on the security issues. From my initial use of the Mac system it seems to me there is 99% less pop ups and general annoyance than on the Windows platform.
This always comes up. The Macintosh has its own anti-malware program built in, and Apple is pretty good about pushing out updates to close security holes as they come up. Generally, if you keep your Mac updated with the latest updates from Apple (something that your Mac will do automatically by default if you don't change any settings), you don't, as yet, need any third party software to protect yourself.
In fact, third party (non-Apple) anti-virus software appears to me to be the number one source of serious problems for Mac users right now. Whenever I hear about a user experiencing slowdowns, lots of wait cursors, odd behavior, etc., it's usually being caused by third party anti-virus software. Fortunately the problem is easy to avoid, because you don't need anti-virus software for your Mac at this time.
It's hard to get recent Windows switchers to get comfortable with concept of not installing anti-virus software. Being paranoid about malware on Windows is a natural thing, after all, there are well over a million viruses for Windows. There is only a handful of malware for the Mac, and most of that isn't really much of a threat at all, if any. See this list of Mac malware, and note the threat level of each:
http://www.thesafem
____________
Randy B. Singer
Co-author of The Macintosh Bible (4th, 5th, and 6th editions)
Macintosh OS X Routine Maintenance
http://www.macattor
____________
Wed Sep 11, 2013 7:06 pm (PDT) . Posted by:
"Michel Munger" mmungermtl
Using a phone as a credit card is mad, as far as security goes. Lose
your phone, lose your card. You're doubly screwed, especially if you are
in a foreign country. It is far more secure to keep them separate.
Michel
jsm5320432@yahoo.com said:
> I will probably stay with my 4s for now as I'm very satisfied with it.
> Never been a big fan of "all my credit card information is on this
> phone" approach. Until the security challenges have been well tested by
> more than just the company selling the phone, I'll stay away from that
> approach.
your phone, lose your card. You're doubly screwed, especially if you are
in a foreign country. It is far more secure to keep them separate.
Michel
jsm5320432@yahoo.
> I will probably stay with my 4s for now as I'm very satisfied with it.
> Never been a big fan of "all my credit card information is on this
> phone" approach. Until the security challenges have been well tested by
> more than just the company selling the phone, I'll stay away from that
> approach.
Wed Sep 11, 2013 10:51 pm (PDT) . Posted by:
"N.A. Nada"
Currently, that is all it does. If you don't count secure the phone from others.
And like I said before, Apple sometime rolls out new technology slowly. First to only their own apps, and when no major security flaws, they roll it out to third party app use.
On Sep 11, 2013, at 1:28 PM, Tony wrote:
But all it does is unlock, and for app purchases
From: Jim Saklad <jimdoc@icloud.com>
To: macsupportcentral@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 12 September 2013 2:40 AM
Subject: Re: [macsupport] New iPhones
>> How are 3rd-parties prevented from storing, re-using, or selling your fingerprint?
>
> Thats a good point, particularly where Androids are susceptible to malware.
>
> The Fingerprint sensor is just a gimmick, adds a minor efficiency gain to those that lock phones. Its good marketing, and for some, a nice feature, so it is a nice wee innovation.
As at least one publication has pointed out, solid fingerprint technology make a device much more useful in business/government use.
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jim Saklad mailto:jimdoc@icloud.com
And like I said before, Apple sometime rolls out new technology slowly. First to only their own apps, and when no major security flaws, they roll it out to third party app use.
On Sep 11, 2013, at 1:28 PM, Tony wrote:
But all it does is unlock, and for app purchases
From: Jim Saklad <jimdoc@icloud.
To: macsupportcentral@
Sent: Thursday, 12 September 2013 2:40 AM
Subject: Re: [macsupport] New iPhones
>> How are 3rd-parties prevented from storing, re-using, or selling your fingerprint?
>
> Thats a good point, particularly where Androids are susceptible to malware.
>
> The Fingerprint sensor is just a gimmick, adds a minor efficiency gain to those that lock phones. Its good marketing, and for some, a nice feature, so it is a nice wee innovation.
As at least one publication has pointed out, solid fingerprint technology make a device much more useful in business/government use.
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jim Saklad mailto:jimdoc@icloud.
Wed Sep 11, 2013 11:15 pm (PDT) . Posted by:
"N.A. Nada"
On Sep 11, 2013, at 1:44 PM, Tony wrote:
From: N.A. Nada <whodo678@comcast.
To: macsupportcentral@
Sent: Thursday, 12 September 2013 6:43 AM
Subject: Re: [macsupport] New iPhones
The reason that Apple is in it's current situation is that Jobs did not worry about market share or reputation for being behind.
Yes. I agree.
So your not worried about Apple current situation, as Jim put it, "Apple is BY FAR the most valuable tech company on the planet, and even after this morning'
If they are behind, why is everyone, especially Samsung trying to copy them? Why are they the ones to change the way we listen to and buy music? Why do they have such a large percentage with basically one model of phone? Why does their basically one model of tablet have so much of the market?
They all copy each other, many of the iOS featues are old Android featues, no issues with that, many companies add to the evolvement, the others copy.
Oh, where is the article that shows that Androids features were stolen or borrowed from Apple, first.
And market share, who cares! They have a large portion of that in everything but computers, and they are number two there, with tons of people switching over every day. You included by your own admission. What do you want to go back to them competing on monitor size or speed? Oh, right, that is what the competition is doing with phones and tablets.
I dont care about market share nor do I care about how much money Apple makes. My point is that many facets that the public enjoy are not with Apple, such as screen size, OS features, that are now standard elsewhere and not offered by Apple. In any case to me the 4S to the 5S are little different, so I focus on iOS and give up on the generic models of the iPhone. But as stated the board told TC he needs to innovate, so they either want market share of more profits or higher share price. I'm not a recent concert, got first iPhone with the 4, then 4S, then 5, and have iPad 1, then 2, then 3
Screen size standard? As someone who does not follow such things, I see not standard size in the industry. And comparing one version of iPhone to the those 2-3 versions apart, you will find very little change. That is why I find it funny that some people have to have the latest versions as soon as it comes out. They want to keep up with the Jones or bragging rights.
Apple focuses on ease of use and experience, not market share. They focus on an integrated package of hardware and software that seamlessly works with other items.
Integration is great, could not agree more
Competition and different innovations by other companies is good, but no one else carries it off a seamlessly as Apple. Hell, the iPhone was not the first cellular phone. It was just one that packaged all those features together. It had one more ingredient that the others didn't, and that was the distortion field. Steve Jobs is one of the best pitchmen since P. T. Barnum, Zig Ziglar, Charles Ponzi or Bernie Madoff.
I agree, but very slow to adopt the new featues available elsewhere that then become standard. However I do see iOS7 as a good catchup, and these days IMO its the OS and not the phone that matters
If you want a more open OS, go with the Android. Just be ready for issues.
As a recent convert, you may not realize that Apple has always been slow to adopt, but fast to abandon. Always. They find interesting new technology and study it, look for ways to implement it, look for its pit falls or abuses, and ways to improve it. They they adopt it before it becomes an industry trend. If you don't believe me, we can start with the mouse.
I agree. I feel the current adoption is slow, just my opinion.
In the past, or maybe I should say with computers, they were the slow adopters, but they adopted before the others. As for fingerprint scanning phones, besides the Motorola ATRIX, do you know of another phone that offers it? Do you know anyone using a Motorola ATRIX? So early adoption may not be all it is cracked up to, if it is not successful. There are several things that Apple adopted, but dropped for that very reason.
Things have not slowed since Jobs died. He formed a team that thinks like he did. They look at problems the same way he did. They innovate the same way he did. They work form the results backwards to what it takes to implement it.
And the reason the world economy is so messed up right now is that the investors and boards have had their way in looking for short term profits. Look at countries that have recovered from economic decimation. Japan business reward their employees for following long term plans, not making a quarterly profit. Has the employee or executive meet the plan to position the company for the next step in the plan?
Brent
On Sep 11, 2013, at 3:29 AM, Tony wrote:
I hear your points Brent, and they are good ones. I feel that the board telling TC that they want innovation is aimed at market share, and/or avoiding a reputation of being behind. I personally feel that the innovations made by other phones are good, and while I don't expect anyone else to immediately bring that out, over time they should. No one invented all the features we see in cars, as a new one was found (auto transmission, electric windows, more recently ABS, Traction Control) they all brought these into production. I feel Apple is lacking in not adopting new features brought out by others, or adopted in others. Larger screen option is one many want. Samsungs Air Gestures are a useful feature. The 4S had the best camera, now many others have superior cameras. This is why I have given up on the iPhone, its iOS I want, whether thats with a 4S, 5, 5C, or 5S makes little difference, they are all very much the same.
But I am assuming that post SJ, things slowed, maybe a concern not to add too much after his passing, board has spoken, so I am expecting a bit of a push. iPhone doesn't have to have the best in any one category, as long as it has the features that many want, it will sell due to the brand. Others like Samsung need the best and most features, as they do not have the "name"
From: N.A. Nada <whodo678@comcast.
To: macsupportcentral@
Sent: Wednesday, 11 September 2013 11:34 AM
Subject: Re: [macsupport] New iPhones
Actually, I find the fingerprint sensor quite nice, and I yawned at the camera upgrade. But since my budget is tight, and my iPhone 4S is only 14 months old, I won't be upgrading.
Although I use a password vault app, I would like my stuff to be a bit more secure. But I find a 4-digit password a pain to use and ridiculously easy to by pass.
Most updates are eye-candy. I'd love to have the ability to use Airdrop on my MBP, but it is one model too old. Not a deal killer or one to make me upgrade.
The instruction to innovate just goes to show how short sighted the board is. These innovations do not happen over night, no matter what anyone demands. Apple currently only needs stocks to reward employees. They don't need it to attract investors or funding, so I think the push to pay dividends counter intuitive to their operations. It only rewards bad habits by investors to expect immediate, constant, and increasing rewards.
Like Tim Cook said at the end of the presentation, they decide on what they want achieve or experience they want to provide, and then they go about developing the means to accomplish it. Hell, they are still working on and extending the secret plans that Steve started and developed with the help of this crew. I'd be more concerned that Tim is up to the Jobs, pun intended. Those are some awfully big shoes to fill, but he did have a good teacher..
Brent
On Sep 10, 2013, at 3:58 PM, Tony wrote:
Underwhelming.
Faster CPU and 64 bit? You will see little real world difference
Camera upgrade, very good
Fingerprint Sensor? Yawn
iOS7, yes a great upgrade but we get that free for iPhone 4 and up.
As board told TC to innovate, next year will be the year that Apple's iPhone takes the world by storm, there will be the larger option and real innovation. I hope for useful and reliable gestures
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